Forum:Uncyclopedia: An Essay On Uncyclopedia by RAHB

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I don't like to talk a lot, and I know you all don't like to read a lot either, so I'll keep this brief. I prefer boxers myself, but some situations call for the lesser of the two underpants styles. This is one of them (I won't get into the "Modus" style).

I love this website. I assume that anybody who's stayed here through all this wikia madness also loves this website. Sure, this website and I have had disagreements in the past. Like that time it ate my Subway sandwich leftovers from the fridge, or the time I put shaving cream on its hand while it was asleep. But when it comes to the internet, there's no place I'd rather waste every waking moment of spare time I have being irresponsible and marginally witty than on Uncyclopedia. I'm having a hard time getting what I'm saying across, so maybe if I phrased my next statement in the form of a small child, it would come across well.

"Mommy? Why is Daddy hurting you?"

I woke up this morning to find Uncyclopedia in pseudo-chaos. People are getting banned for going with the flow, mass-vandalizing IPs are being allowed to roam the streets, and those gosh darn kids won't get off my lawn. I'm thinking about taking a hiatus from editing myself, but not to protest some supposed evil force that we've been allied with for the past whatever years, because they wanted to add five letters to our site URL and absolutely nothing else to our website. Mine would be to escape from all the rampant stupidity I see around here, and have been seeing for the past month or so, whenever it was sannse made the announcement about the move. Do you guys realize what this is accomplishing? Think hard now. Oh that's right. Absolutely fucking nothing.

You can all have your protests and your "patriotism", all that matters to me is that I signed on this morning, saw "uncyclopedia.wikia.com" in the URL bar, and was still able to do my site maintenance with absolutely no disruptions. Or the fact that after five seconds of doing whatever it is I do here, I completely forgot about the fucking URL bar and got down to the fact that I was still editing Uncyclopedia, just as I had left it the night before, albeit there were a few more people running around like chickens with their heads cut off. Tell me what's missing. Huh? What integral part of this website (aside from all this bullshit about this somehow ruining our credibility, how I will never know) is missing, now that we've made the move? VFD is still there. QVFD is still there. Oh hey, look, there's VFH, struggling to stay alive, like some sort of water-dwelling animal thrust into the vast emptiness of the Sahara desert. My userpage is still there, and so far my articles are all in tact. And they all have "uncyclopedia.wikia.com" at the front. And Nobody, pressing forward through the sands of time like the energizer fucking bunny, continues to care.

I don't know what good I expect to do with this post. I'm really just posting because I feel something sort of telling me to. My Uncyclopedia sense was tingling, if you will. On one last note, I support a move to our own domain, if it will make everyone happy, but please, find out what the hell we're going to do. We've had all this time to decide after all, but we've just been standing around waiting for this whole thing to happen. This is not a revolution. This is just some guys trying to be heroes for a website on the internet. Trying to play Wikia out to be some sort of immoral satan spawn of destruction. And the righteous Uncyclopedians are supposed to slay the horrible beast and get all the chicks and hot rods in the end or something. I don't know. Like I said. As long as I can log on and do stuff like I always do, I just don't see the point. -RAHB 20:13, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

You may not know what you expected to do with this post, but I know what it's done to me. It's made me realise how utterly pathetic this whole farce is. We can all edit, there are no ads, people still find us if they type 'uncyclopedia.org' in the URL bar. When it comes down to it, what's to complain about? (Bonner) (Talk) Oct 24, 20:32

I'm not an admin, so I don't have to deal with the crap you put up with in the name of comedy for, RAHB. But I think that your speech made me realize that what people who aren't me do on this site is making people happy. I tell people at school, "Hey, go to uncyclopedia.org and look up this" or something, and they laugh their faces off. So, in all reality, we ARE making people happy here. We are. - Velosi-T {] Screech * Vomit * Mutilations [} 20:53, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

I don't like the new URL. Something about seeing wikia whoring themselves at the top of my browser window just doesn't sit right with me. But vandalism is not going to do jack shit to help the situation and only makes us look like assholes. If we're gonna move, let's fucking move, and if we're gonna do some kind of admin strike, someone do that, but, once the smoke clears, I just want to come back to the same Uncyclopedia that I've always loved editing. - P.M., WotM, & GUN, Sir Led Balloon (Tick Tock) (Contribs) 21:02, Oct 24

I don't like the new URL either, but if that's the worst thing that happens, we've got it pretty good. Sir Modusoperandi ^Boinc! 03:03, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

Honestly, yeah. I mean, I'm not fond of this change, not in the least. But for now, I'll live with it. It doesn't make a huge difference to anything when it comes down to it. And I don't think people should start flocking off just because of a domain change. A lot of people are mad about ads. When we get ads, I fully encourage getting pissed off and rebelling. For right now, live with it. I was kind of mad about it, but one day later, I really just could not care less anymore. --Mr. Monkey Pant-hoot here. 21:06, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

Quite a relief to read this. I was seriously thinking I was missing something important by just not seeing what the fuss was all about. RabbiTechno 19:41, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

Can I haz my own header?

The point? For me it's an issue of principle. I joined Uncyc because I thought it was a non-profit making humours parody of Wikipedia. I personally feel that our role as a parody of Wikipedia has wider importance to the internet than us just being funny, and that our independence is a very important part of that. If we were "just a humour site" then I would not have a problem with someone making money out of what I do here. Payment is justified for service rendered after all. However I don't feel that it's possible to correctly parody Wikipedia if we are making money for someone. The exact financial figures regarding what Uncyc costs to run and what we make them (in terms of clicks to other wikis which do have adverts) has been requested but not forthcoming. Wikia tell us "You cost to much, so you have to have this", and yet they are not able to provide the figures which this claim is based on.

The simple fact that Wikia wishes to make profit whereas we do not is (obviously just in my opinion) a very difficult situation. It is just a name change (so far) but I feel that a stand needs to be taken somewhere. We have asked for a "no adverts in the future" guarantee but this has not been given. I should emphasise how grateful I am to Wikia for being honest about this. Some users get very aggressive and passionate saying that Wikia are evil. They are not. It would have been a lot easer to lie about this, and yet they did not. For that, I respect them. There are many much worse companies than Wikia in this world. Of that I am sure.

I also feel very upset about how this was presented to us. It was not discussed. We were told, and it happened. I feel that this is the kind of treatment which we can expect in the future. If this was simply about meeting the running costs of the site then I'm sure that the (small costs) can be met by donations from a number of users who have already offered their financial support. Wikia appear to not be interested in this, and I feel like I am being forced into becoming part of a profit making site against my will. I do not want that. That is why I am not editing Uncyclopedia...

If Uncyc costs too much for Wikia to run they have the option of not doing so. A non-profit making consortium similar to that which supports Wikipedia could be created. To me, this option appears to be the best for everyone. Wikia need not loose any more money supporting a site which is not financially viable, and Uncyc will be able to parody Wikipedia in a way which I feel it should. MrN 21:45, Oct 24

For donations given to the site. However, it's not that the cost of running Uncyc was too much, it was that advertisers didn't see us as part of Wikia, apparently. --Mr. Monkey Pant-hoot here. 21:47, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

I understand your concerns, and I understand that a majority of users feel the same. The solution: Move the site and get it overwith. You're not going to get Wikia to do something non-profit, the whole idea from the beginning of Wikia was that it is most certainly for profit. The Uncyclopedians before us knew that when they signed up for the hosting, the Uncyclopedians of now and the past have known that during our/their whole stay here. We've been given a large amount of space during our stay with Wikia, and haven't had a lot of the standard criteria forced upon us that other wikis have. Now that they want to give us something that every other wiki has, everybody has decided to scream "witch" and "identity". Well, I'm all for keeping the site's "identity". But first, we have to take responsibility for having never done anything in the past, knowing full well that it could possibly happen, and that it would not violate any sort of agreement we have with Wikia. If you guys want to move the site, I support it 100%. But if we're just going to sit here, then absolutely none of us is in any situation to complain. -RAHB 22:26, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

Why we don't want to move is because Wikia are giving us free hosting. Why we didn't want the move, is our fear of ads, which would therefore make us for profit, while our license is non commercial, which a lot of people here think is what ads would kind of break. JudgeZarbi TALK 22:29, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

It all comes back to exactly what I said. We knew all of that stuff in the beginning. They aren't springing some surprise attack on us here, it's always been there, and it's even been addressed in the past, I'm sure. Bottom line is, we're going one of two ways at this point. Get our own domain and have it supported by the users, or stick with Wikia and allow them to do anything in these realms to us. None of this violates some ancient prophecy etched on stone, that says the evil Wikian overlords may not oppress the people of Uncyclopedia. This is all stuff we agreed to, and have continued to agree to as long as we have had Wikia as our host. Once more, say the word and I'd be going for the new domain in a heartbeat. Otherwise, I don't think there's any form of valid argument here. -RAHB 22:36, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

I am not a technical person, but I believe the technical hangups involving "just moving" involve:

1. finding our first choice of host Carlb and contacting him about this
2. getting Wikia to release the user database to the site for the move (which they have so far refused on "privacy grounds" that were anywhere from vague to imaginary).
3. Finding Carlb, our first choice to host us, so we can move

So we're just working on those three things, and we should be moving post-haste. Oh, and if anyone has seen Carlb, could you tell him we're looking for him?--<<>> 22:47, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

Right-o. -RAHB 22:51, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

Yeah! Anyway, I'd rather not have the URL change, but I don't think Wikia is going to change back anytime soon, especially with our less than stellar response to it. In all honestly, I don't think it is really that big of a deal. I do think we should move though, and I have always been of the opinion that Uncyc should be independent if possible. Nothing the users do to protest is really going to change Wikia's mind; all it does is make them think we are assholes, which lowers the chances of them releasing the user database and possibly giving us our domain. As long as we are hosted on Wikia, we are their bitch, and there is nothing we can do to change that, because they pay for us to exist. In conclusion, move to a new host or deal with the domain change. - UnIdiot | | Talk | Contribs - 00:26, Oct 25

On being Wikia's bitch: As long as we get secure server space and software upgrades for free then we have chosen to use Wikia. It's not like we got enslaved or something. Wikia has been quite good to Uncyc. It feels a bit to me like a bunch of you now want to bite the hand that has fed you -- for fucking free -- since 2005. And I agree with RAHB: the reason is trivial. I will mention more one thing: if Uncyc moves to a privately hosted server the first thing I'm doing is downloading all my shit articles onto my personal PC, because I think that chances are better than even that such a move will be the beginning of the end. I advise any of you with a non-trivial number of articles to do the same. ----OEJ 01:48, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

What if we have a non-trivial number of articles, but the articles themselves are trivial? Sir Modusoperandi ^Boinc! 03:01, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

The domain move is not about uncyclopedia

Here's the exact and entire reason for the domain name change:

• Wikia.com's site rank and views are dropping.
• Wikia needs a higher rank to appear more popular to advertisers.
• Uncyclopedia, Memory Alpha, and WoWwiki, etc have a site rank and page views (for uncyclopedia, roughly 100,000 unique visitors per day, avg 3.5 page views each).
• Wikia wants those to be attributed directly to wikia.com, to appear more popular to advertisers.
• End of reasoning.

Wikia is using uncyclopedia for its own gain, with absolutely no consideration as to how the uncyclopedia community feels about it (or if there was consideration, it was ignored). It's exactly what they said they wouldn't do from day one. It's entirely against what they claim to be as a company.

It's absolutely nothing to do with ads or hosting costs. It's entirely to do with wikia propping up their page rank. If you're happy for the site to be used in this way, then that's your prerogative. I, and many others, will not stand for it. It's far too far, and we are not willing to let it happen.

And RAHB, you say "You're not going to get Wikia to do something non-profit" - well, you might have not noticed this yet, but uncyclopedia is non-profit. Legally. Which is part of the whole problem here, because eventually, they'll use uncyclopedia for their own gain and profit, without uncyclopedia itself taken into account. And that's exactly what's happened here. And as for the whole "uncyclopedia owe wikia for hosting it" thing - wrong. Uncyclopedia doesn't owe wikia anything. Wikia paid for uncyclopedia knowing full well it was non-profit, and the entire reason they paid for it was for the google ads, and the links it would generate back to wikia. They were the ones that swapped the google ads with the wikia spotlight, to switch the focus to driving clicks to wikia up. They are already getting everything they paid for out of uncyclopedia. But it's not enough for them, so now there's this situation. If it was anything to do with hosting costs vs. benefit to wikia, they'd have let carlb host the project by now.

As for those of you saying we should host it ourselves: we have the means and the ability to do exactly that (for fucking free), and have offered exactly that several (thousand) times. But wikia refuse to let the project go, because, guess what, the entire reason they host it is for the page views/rank it generates for them, and so will a) hold on to it forever, even at the cost of the community, or b) let it go at the cost of hard cash. Though nobody has been willing to give a figure yet. There's no "choose" about it. We're locked in to whatever wikia want to do to us, unless we stand up for ourselves and our community. • Spang • ☃ • talk • 04:24, 25 Oct 2008

P.S. This is all stuff we agreed to - No, nobody agreed to anything like this. And now we're not agreeing - and you're complaining about it. Go figure. • Spang • ☃ • talk • 04:27, 25 Oct 2008

Well, you obviously know more than I do about the situation. So the only point I can continue to bring up is as such: What is all of that taking away from Uncyclopedia? So Wikia wants page hits. How does that keep Uncyclopedia from operating anything like it always has? It doesn't stop me from clicking the Uncyclopedia.org bookmark, whatever URL it decides to redirect me to. It doesn't stop me from writing articles. It doesn't stop any Uncyclopedian from doing site maintenance, or voting, or any of the other stuff that makes this site run well. It doesn't tell the userbase, "sorry, you can't function as a cohesive community anymore." Is there any way that this move hinders our ability to run our website? If you can bring up a legitimate answer (none of this "we'll lose our soul" rubbish), I'll jump right aboard the "burn Wikia" train. -RAHB 06:37, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

With respect, I think there is distinctly shady and dishonest slant to Wikia's stance on this - I think that this move is going to be part of a wider policy to gain greater profits, as Spang is saying. The company has disregarded the wishes of the community - which is wrong - hopfully as is my understanding there will be further dialogue to reslove the problem. Wikia is not our friend at the moment - I think there could be many problems ahead if a clear line is not taken by the community--Sycamore (Talk) 06:52, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

Why does Wikipedia not have a .wikia url? Why did Jimbo make it a separate organisation? MrN 07:00, Oct 25

RAHB, Wikia is making this move over the protest of the entire community. What this means is that Wikia has proven itself willing and able to override the wishes of the community, take action that affects the site, and cite profit as the motive (which goes against our legal copyright). What THIS means is that we are losing our autonomy, our independence, our freedom, our integrity, and our ideals if we let this happen. You've made it clear that our ideals are worth very much in your eyes, and that's fine. Not everyone is idealistic. We are still losing a lot of other things in the process. I'm sorry if this seems as though I'm talking down to you, but you were asking for more of an explanation, so I'm trying to spell it out more clearly.--<<>> 11:45, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

Oh, no offense of any kind taken. I understand what you're saying, I understand Spang's explanation, and I understand why the majority of the community has adopted this mindset, and I appreciate you explaining it to me. I should probably be more outraged than I am, it seems. I'll go on with my "not such a big deal" mindset, but I'll keep it under wraps now that this whole voting thing has started. While I have my own opinions about things right now, the best way is to make sure the community as a whole gets what it wants. -RAHB 20:00, 25 October 2008 (UTC)